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Natty achievable
Yup, agreed with this. I follow this girl and she's very cool. Supporting evidence:
1) Arms that are visibly muscular but not enormous and "popping" 2) Fairly modest traps and delts. No huge capped shoulders. 3) She's certainly lean and watches what she eats, but she's not ripped 4) She often poses in full-length leggings, but her legs still have some curves. I'd wager that they're not super lean.
And if you're reading this Julia: all of this is meant as a compliment! I love both natural and enhanced FBB's and I think you're all amazing, regardless of how you choose to train and appear.
I would say natty achievable, but I doubt she is because of how much muscle she has at such a young age (20.) Plus, she is a TikTok fitness influencer, and that is rife with PED users and SARM goblins
Agreed, and I suspect that you're right. If she's been totally about that life since like 15 and she has great genetics, then she might be able to get that much mass by 20. Doubtful, as being a teenager and all will get in the way, and most likely that she's run some light cycles.
And wow, I only started playing with SARMs last year and they are phenomenal. Where have these things been my whole life?!?
Agreed, and I suspect that you're right. If she's been totally about that life since like 15 and she has great genetics, then she might be able to get that much mass by 20. Doubtful, as being a teenager and all will get in the way, and most likely that she's run some light cycles.
And wow, I only started playing with SARMs last year and they are phenomenal. Where have these things been my whole life?!? She has put that size in like 2 years. She was a normal girl before with no devolpment or something
Is she natural? This photo was taken in the late 19th century. Testosterone was first identified in the 1930s and earliest synthetic anabolic steroids appeared in the later 40s.
Rhetorical question, has to be and therefore is. Even then, nothing pops out that would suggest steroids—she carries a decent amount of body fat, traps and delts aren't overly developed, and given that she was a trapeze artist, we can assume that she's short, so much easier to fill out. Good example of a top-tier natty female physique.
Rhetorical question, has to be and therefore is.
It is, we were having a discussion about in the comments of one of the images with Charmion’s name.
Compare Scythian's pic to any number of women on this site who "must be" using PEDs because they are "too big" not to be—Dana Lynn Bailey, for one: we all know she's lying about being "natural", don't we? Or any number of Crossfitters, among whom the PED use rate is 100%. There are admitted (perhaps self-proclaimed would be a better term) heavy PED users on this site who are even bigger, but doesn't isn't this woman beyond all women's natural limits, that can only be exceeded by use of PEDs?
doesn't isn't this woman beyond all women's natural limits, that can only be exceeded by use of PEDs?
I wouldn’t say that since Charmion is nowhere near the level of most of the girls on here if I’m gonna be honest. Dana and most cross fitters are a hell of a lot bigger than her too. I’d say for most if not all of the bodybuilder/strong women pre-1958 their physiques are natty achievable.
So what do you all think about this woman? Is she natural? This photo was taken in the late 19th century. Testosterone was first identified in the 1930s and earliest synthetic anabolic steroids appeared in the later 40s.
Ah the popular b+w pictures of the last century.
Does this prove that the thousands of ripped competitors with 3 years of training experience are natty?
You can find many such physiques at Cirque du Soleil this does not make bikini competitors drug free.
Get over it, everyone with a worthy physique is juicing. Here is another coach telling the truth about women and juice. Watch after 31st minute. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qfBMG6rpik
A year or two ago charming Bob explained to me that he can determine PED use from photographs because he had abused the stuff himself (I guess it’s a side effect the developers of Anavar or whatever didn’t investigate when they were testing safety and efficacy for the FDA). Non-abusers like me could have “no say” in the matter.
If Mr. 206791 offered to save a hospital a lot of money on lab fees by diagnosing high cholesterol, or diabetes, or something from photos of patients, his claim would be easy to evaluate. An investigator would collect photos of people who had already been found to have the condition and mix them with photos of people who tested negative for it. If Bob could accurately distinguish those with the condition from those without, his claim would be verified. The photos would have to not be of people whose medical history Bob already knew, and not contain any contextual clues. And of course Bob would have to agree that the confirmatory test was accurate, that the evaluator would be honest about the results, etc.
We can’t apply this methodology to Bob’s claimed ability because we don’t have an alternative test for previous lifetime PED use that we can compare to Bob’s assessments. Pictures of women who died long before any of the PEDs Bob says he can detect provide guaranteed negatives. But like the photo of “Chamion”, they are readily identifiable as such. So, surprise! surprise!, Bob found that “Chamion” was nowhere near as well developed as the women whose muscularity he says proves that they are PED users.
No one can demonstrate or prove that Bob and the others on this site who claim they can be certain about the PED use of women pictured here are full of, er, baloney. But for the same reason, Bob and his fellow photo evaluators can’t demonstrate that they have the ability they claim, either.
Winstanley, I am curious: why do you have such a vested interest in denying the prominence of PED use in women’s strength and aesthetics sports?
There are guys here who are actually involved in bodybuilding, powerlifting and the like. When we tell you how prominent PED use is because we bear actual witness to it from, again, our own exposure to that environment, it’s best to acknowledge it.
Winstanley, I am curious: why do you have such a vested interest in denying the prominence of PED use in women’s strength and aesthetics sports?
Maybe in his mind he is standing up for them and defending them because they can't defend themselves. (slight misogyny there but he won't see that).
He is a knight, a champion. His armor is a cheetos stained t-shirt.
Winstanley, I am curious: why do you have such a vested interest in denying the prominence of PED use in women’s strength and aesthetics sports?
There are guys here who are actually involved in bodybuilding, powerlifting and the like. When we tell you how prominent PED use is because we bear actual witness to it from, again, our own exposure to that environment, it’s best to acknowledge it.
I really don’t understand this attitude. I’m just in a discussion with someone that Mal O’Brien of CrossFit is on gear (the occasion being she withdrew from this years Games) and he doesn’t think she’s on gear.
Please.
The odds that someone at the top of any sport isn’t using SOMETHING are low. We just ask for honesty if they get caught md if there are no repercussions, jsut admit it and stop lying.
Maybe in his mind he is standing up for them and defending them because they can't defend themselves. (slight misogyny there but he won't see that).
He is a knight, a champion. His armor is a cheetos stained t-shirt.
I've had quite a few of these conversations, and I wouldn't say that being a knight is the goal.
I can't speak for Winstanley808 specifically, but in my experience it comes down to their fantasy of the athlete as a pure sexual object.
They like this woman in a sexual way and they find her body arousing. But since the media has told them that PED use is wrong and it's "cheating," they've internalized that. And they've also internalized the frankly insane narrative that PED use is somehow super rare, and the high profile athletes who are caught are the only cheaters out there.
So in their mind they've built up these girls to be their own personal fantasy come true, and facing the fact that she 1000000% uses PEDs like the majority of other high performing female athletes... well that goes against the narrative, so there's a strong desire to deny it.
This doesn't have to be a sexual thing. Lots of tennis fans out there will swear up and down that Serena Williams has never touched a PED despite the OVERWHELMING physical and anecdotal evidence of the opposite, but it's not in line with their fantasy for her.
Attacking a person's motivation is a fallacy of irrelevance, and it goes both ways. If someone believes in a toxic kind of masculinity that bristles at the idea of naturally strong women, or worships the idea of women being bigger and stronger, neither matters. If one person is predisposed to either attitude, then it's worth taking into account that priors could be biasing one's worldview.
I've had quite a few of these conversations, and I wouldn't say that being a knight is the goal.
I can't speak for Winstanley808 specifically, but in my experience it comes down to their fantasy of the athlete as a pure sexual object.
They like this woman in a sexual way and they find her body arousing. But since the media has told them that PED use is wrong and it's "cheating," they've internalized that. And they've also internalized the frankly insane narrative that PED use is somehow super rare, and the high profile athletes who are caught are the only cheaters out there.
So in their mind they've built up these girls to be their own personal fantasy come true, and facing the fact that she 1000000% uses PEDs like the majority of other high performing female athletes... well that goes against the narrative, so there's a strong desire to deny it.
This doesn't have to be a sexual thing. Lots of tennis fans out there will swear up and down that Serena Williams has never touched a PED despite the OVERWHELMING physical and anecdotal evidence of the opposite, but it's not in line with their fantasy for her.
I agree with that. I think for guys like him, part of the fantasy isn't just towards women who are stronger and more fit than average men or even men who lift; it's also hinged on the belief that they were able to do it by only sheer hard work and clean eating and not on chemical assistance because that somehow invalidates the fetish entirely. Which I don't understand. The popular narrative is that PED use is "cheating," but the reality is that you also have to put a lot of hard work into training WITH PEDs. I know quite a few people who use but look like shit because their training sucks, their diet sucks, they drink too much or all three at once.
And for a guy with as much odd encyclopedic knowledge of CrossFit, I wonder if he has actually done it, or has been around average CrossFitters and high-level ones. It kind of reminds me of that dude in the movie "The Menu" who acts like a total food snob and connoisseur, but when he was challenged to make his own meal it turned out to be shit lol.
For sure.. Thats why next to most women on this site she also looks like shes never touched a weight lol.. despite being obviously quite fit.