Forum
>
General / Nonfiction
>
Thread
Log in |
Register
Desi is in my opinion what a prefect female form looks like and is probably natural. Gabby is just too big to be natural.
No one with any visible muscle whatsoever according to most of these guys. There's no point in debating it since everyone is just speculating. I'm not naive, but I also realize that it's possible for women to develop muscle without steroids and that different women have wildly different potential. Some woman are naturally muscular or wiry before they pick up a single dumbbell. Others work out hard and take PED's and STILL can't develop biceps like some natural women do. But I stay out of the argument because it's futile and speaking in absolutes about who is or isn't taking them is ridiculous. Unless you're talking about someone with a receding hairline, facial hair, deep voice and absurdly obvious side effects.
No way one can tell for sure. Apparently any girl with any slight muscle definition is on gear which I find to be a huge misconception. The ones who I consider natural is Cass Martin, Stephanie Sanzo and Lauren Findley at their peak.
No one with any visible muscle whatsoever according to most of these guys. There's no point in debating it since everyone is just speculating. I'm not naive, but I also realize that it's possible for women to develop muscle without steroids and that different women have wildly different potential. Some woman are naturally muscular or wiry before they pick up a single dumbbell. Others work out hard and take PED's and STILL can't develop biceps like some natural women do. But I stay out of the argument because it's futile and speaking in absolutes about who is or isn't taking them is ridiculous. Unless you're talking about someone with a receding hairline, facial hair, deep voice and absurdly obvious side effects.
We need to question these things, because they create unrealistic body ideals. Even as a guy who lifts religiously, my teens and 20's were spent wondering why no amount of dieting or lifting could get me to a sub 15% bodyfat without feeling like death or looking like Michael B. Jordan in Creed. Its not that people think muscles = steroids. The fitness industry is so inundated with people using PED's its just impossible to tell, and then people who claim natty but clearly arent like Dana Lynn Bailey and Caroline Marquez dont help. Someone can claim they arent on steroids and can be telling the truth, but what about SARMs, or anavar? There are tons of "light" ped's that produce the gymshark quality bodies that we see. Then there's the crossfitters. There is no way that many (not all) of these women arent on something.
I agree that these things need to be discussed, however they need to be discussed in such a way that facts are being presented, rather than speculation. These threads tend to be 99% speculation and every once in a blue moon, someone will produce a link to a scientific article or athlete admitting to using. Otherwise the general formula for these threads tend to be:
Person A: "I think ____ is natty."
Person B: "Clearly she's not."
Person A: "You don't know what you're talking about, she said she is."
Person B: "People lie."
Person C: "People are still seriously arguing over this? Why does it even matter?"
No point whatsoever in discussion. If you do find out, what difference is it going to make. Are you going to stop following someone if they are using, or if they're not. I don't understand this ridiculous obsession with who is doing what. Complete waste of time.
No point whatsoever in discussion. If you do find out, what difference is it going to make. Are you going to stop following someone if they are using, or if they're not. I don't understand this ridiculous obsession with who is doing what. Complete waste of time.
cgsweat the prophet
I'd say it helps manage expectations. I don't imagine most people on here know a lot about PEDs. They just see girls with big muscles and think "why don't more women look like this?" Knowing what's naturally achievable can help guys (and girls) be more realistic about what to expect from women they'd meet at the local gym, for instance.
I agree that these things need to be discussed, however they need to be discussed in such a way that facts are being presented, rather than speculation. These threads tend to be 99% speculation and every once in a blue moon, someone will produce a link to a scientific article or athlete admitting to using. Otherwise the general formula for these threads tend to be:
Person A: "I think ____ is natty."
Person B: "Clearly she's not."
Person A: "You don't know what you're talking about, she said she is."
Person B: "People lie."
Person C: "People are still seriously arguing over this? Why does it even matter?"
You're right, there is no way to know unless they say it, so we have to be discerning and curious about who's natural and who isn't because it influences us. It's one thing to find muscular women attractive but it's another to have unrealistic body expectations for a partner or even for oneself. Personally if I learn or suspect a fitness influencer is unnatural, I may still follow them, but purely for their aesthetics. My belief is that if you are a fitness influencer then you should be obligated to say if you are natural or not because others are setting expectations for themselves based off of you (And you're probably also selling workout/diet plans). Im not against PED's at all, but I'm against lying about what it truly takes to look like a certain way.
My belief is that if you are a fitness influencer then you should be obligated to say if you are natural or not because others are setting expectations for themselves based off of you (And you're probably also selling workout/diet plans). Im not against PED's at all, but I'm against lying about what it truly takes to look like a certain way.
That's a nice sentiment, but it's not realistic and that will never happen for two reasons:
PED use is illegal in many parts of the world. Most people aren't going to talk about things that they do that would get them in trouble with the law.
A lot of influencers are sponsored by supplement companies, clothing lines and workout equipment manufacturers. And while I'm sure the owners and executives of those companies are well-aware of the prevalence of PED use in the industry along with the fact that their sponsored athletes are probably on them, they market their products on the public's ignorance of PEDs. If a dude with arms the size of an average man's thighs in hawking MuscleTech supplements, then Joe Sixpack who wants to look like him but has minimal knowledge about training, nutrition and muscle hypertrophy, then he will be more likely to buy those products. The second that that athlete admits to using drugs to obtain his body, the allure of that supplement will be gone, and you'll have a few very pissed up MuscleTech executives.
A lot of things in the fitness industry are really based on a fantasy: the fantasy that you can get the body of your favorite influencer if you only do these movements, or take this powder, or buy their nutrition program. Meanwhile, actual good personal trainers and certified nutritionists get very little attention on social media because what they are promoting, and what works, isn't sexy. The most effective programs are pretty boring and nothing special, and the same can be said for diets, and unfortunately, the nature of social media means that the men and women with the most insane chemically enhanced bodies will have the most followers and get the most attention. And it sucks because it makes the people who have good physiques that are truly natural be far less exposed because the goalpost of what is the most visible are those enhanced, unrealistic bodies.
In other words, it's more of a "don't hate the player, hate the game." Really, the only way to get realistic expectations of what you can achieve is to unfollow pretty much every fitness influencer, and instead find a good certified trainer and licensed dietitian/nutritionist who will give you an honest and no bullshit perspective of what you can achieve naturally and over the course of YEARS.
That's a nice sentiment, but it's not realistic and that will never happen for two reasons:
PED use is illegal in many parts of the world. Most people aren't going to talk about things that they do that would get them in trouble with the law.
A lot of influencers are sponsored by supplement companies, clothing lines and workout equipment manufacturers. And while I'm sure the owners and executives of those companies are well-aware of the prevalence of PED use in the industry along with the fact that their sponsored athletes are probably on them, they market their products on the public's ignorance of PEDs. If a dude with arms the size of an average man's thighs in hawking MuscleTech supplements, then Joe Sixpack who wants to look like him but has minimal knowledge about training, nutrition and muscle hypertrophy, then he will be more likely to buy those products. The second that that athlete admits to using drugs to obtain his body, the allure of that supplement will be gone, and you'll have a few very pissed up MuscleTech executives.
A lot of things in the fitness industry are really based on a fantasy: the fantasy that you can get the body of your favorite influencer if you only do these movements, or take this powder, or buy their nutrition program. Meanwhile, actual good personal trainers and certified nutritionists get very little attention on social media because what they are promoting, and what works, isn't sexy. The most effective programs are pretty boring and nothing special, and the same can be said for diets, and unfortunately, the nature of social media means that the men and women with the most insane chemically enhanced bodies will have the most followers and get the most attention. And it sucks because it makes the people who have good physiques that are truly natural be far less exposed because the goalpost of what is the most visible are those enhanced, unrealistic bodies.
In other words, it's more of a "don't hate the player, hate the game." Really, the only way to get realistic expectations of what you can achieve is to unfollow pretty much every fitness influencer, and instead find a good certified trainer and licensed dietitian/nutritionist who will give you an honest and no bullshit perspective of what you can achieve naturally and over the course of YEARS.
I agree, this isn't a perfect world, and therefore, that is why I think it is okay for us to question whether all fitness athletes and bodybuilders are natural, because honestly we can't know, and the answer is probably more often than not yes. I am just saying that we need to be honest that many of these influencers are selling dreams and fantasies and there is nothing wrong with questioning that
I read everyone's posts, thanks for your input guys. My intention with the OP was not to flame anyone or stir negative emotion.
I've seen several poste asking if someone in particular was on or off. My intention was to bring an open discussion about whom we felt were OFF. Not the reverse.
For example, Desi Johnson is off IMO. Jen Huder probably as well.
That's about it really. Gabby Fortune...still unsure but it's my opinion. :-)
1) I have never met this athlete and do not speak for her.
2) I am not a physician/medical professional.
3) I am not a trained sports scientist.
4) My stated observations are purely my own and do not reflect the views of any other person, company, or organization with which I may be affiliated.
Everyone has a different definition of "natural" - which I'm not about to debate that with anyone because a) I don't give a shit and b) see "a" - and that's fine. It's my opinion, however, that this young athlete is "natural" by almost any Western definition, even though her strength on this particular lift (video included) is far greater than average. Superior technique alone doesn't account for the incredible strength it takes to shoulder press 50-lb dumbbells.
Bottom line: some people just have better genetics than you.
Rather than asking which GWM regulars are ON...who is OFF and Natural?
Desi Johnson surely. Gabby Fortune...?
Yeah, I'm struggling now.
Regulars not one-offs.
What do you guys think??
Desi Johnson is clearly on. There is nothing natural about her muscles. Look at her bulkiness, thick shoulders etc. You can also see her face is altered from juicing. To even ask about Gabby.. man you are living in the blue.
Desi Johnson is clearly on. There is nothing natural about her muscles. Look at her bulkiness, thick shoulders etc. You can also see her face is altered from juicing. To even ask about Gabby.. man you are living in the blue.
Pretty sure Desi is WADA tested, being a track athlete.
Gabby, I know some girls that shape natural. Her early pictures are softer and look that way. "In the blue"...whatever that means. :-)
Marion Jones never failed a drug test.
Lance Armstrong never failed a drug test.
True, but citing two of the biggest drug cheats ever doesn't mean every athlete cheats.
Desi is in my opinion what a prefect female form looks like and is probably natural. Gabby is just too big to be natural.
Completely agree about Ms Johnson. Dream woman physique. :-)
Rather than asking which GWM regulars are ON...who is OFF and Natural?
Desi Johnson surely. Gabby Fortune...?
Yeah, I'm struggling now.
Regulars not one-offs.
What do you guys think??