For me I start losing interest when side effects start to become apparent.
There's probably a point where they're taking roids but I have no idea, as side effects aren't yet visible but they are getting a nicer physique as a result. Or, to use MSPaint:
I couldn't have explained my POV any better than this, well done!
There is always going to be side effects to PEDs. I think it is a bit hypocritical to when someone finds muscular women attractive, but only if they don't show too many side effects. There is a reason why female bodybuilders don't want guys that are attracted to them(schmoes). It is just a fantasy for a lot of them. These women are training their butts off to achieve an incredible level of athleticism only to be subjected to someone's fantasy. As far as Gatsby28's friend, she should've probably searched for another coach since she shouldn't be in a whole cocktail of drugs. Women really don't need as much drugs to gain muscle except the high level competitors and even still that can vary from athlete to athlete. Personally, I don't mind if she is hairier or has a deeper voice as long as she is comfortable with the trade offs in performance. My two cents.
Rack12 wrote {{ I don't think I'd like to be with one especially if she looks bigger and stronger. I'd want that privately, but not in the open for everyone to see.}}
Tre's response {{ Wow.😕}}. I'm with Tre' on this. I loved being with such a strong, muscular woman. Yeah, I got some wise cracks and snickers but I was very proud of her. I bought her as many halter tops and sleeveless outfits, as my meager income could afford. I showed her off every chance I had.
Are there any kinds of disproportions you enjoy on a muscular girl?
I'm kinda fascinated by Ruzhena Bedzir's body, a lot of bicep meat in amazing shape, but not that much muscularity otherwise (maybe except for glutes).
Same goes for most female armwrestlers, gigantic forearms that make their big biceps looks average in contrast.
This has been very informative, and thanks for the detail there Gatsby. At the end of the day, I think you're right. We shouldn't expect that these girls are all natural. I guess I'm just not at all in to the totally huge she-hulk look. As in, she's 5'5", weighs 220lbs and all muscle. Hard pass! Absent that, zits all of he face, and deep voice (other side effects) are also buzz kills.
So for me, as long as they still look and (even more importantly) SOUND female... I can be into that. I can at least pretend they're natural :D
A lot of people here have mentioned the deep voice side effect.
The thing about that is... some of the smaller women you'd never think would have a deep voice, do... and some of the larger women you'd expect to have a deep voice, don't.
I know I've experienced this many times, but I don't recall many specific examples. In the latter category I think I remember Angie Salvagno and Michaela Aycock having unexpectedly feminine voices despite their size. I will say that with Michaela this is from 3-4 years ago so it's possible her voice has deepened since then.
The smaller women (Bikini-level and smaller) don't interest me as much and so the examples (of deeper than expected voices) I've seen aren't as memorable.
That MSPaint chart is terrific (grin). That's pretty much how I feel about it.
This isn't an easy call for me. I'd prefer all-natural gal, but if she's using a tiny touch of Anavar to get good results I wouldn't be terribly bothered. But, when she starts going bald and developing the deep voice it becomes a big no-go for me.
Of course (unless she's a genetic freak) she'll never get the huge, massive, bodybuilding-style muscularity without heavy PED use ... and that's okay with me.
That's why I usually watch the videos with the sound turned off. I've occasionally left it on and when they sound like Barry White or James Earl Jones it's a major buzz kill.
There is no bodybuilding (male or female) without PEDs, so anyone who values the former also needs to accept the latter. For females in particular, restricting oneself to natural physiques only will lose you about 95% of the content on this site, and the "but she LOOKS natty" angle only works as long as you don't know what unenhanced physiques actually look like. For me, the bottom line is simple: As long as the girl finds no issue with PED usage, I don't have a reason to find any either.
Agreed.
A lot of guys here (especially the ones who don't train themselves) really have no clue as to what is achievable naturally, especially as a woman. Having a preference for muscular women means accepting the fact that the overwhelming majority of physiques that we find visually appealing are not possible unless one is using PEDs. The problem (for lack of a better word) with sites like this is that it results in a kind of confirmation bias amongst the guys who browse it. They see a ubiquitous number of muscular women and think it's becoming more of a norm, or that it represents the results of women starting to get into the weight room. That warped view results in when they see an actual natural woman who lifts 5+ days a week, but think they either don't lift or barely do. Gaining muscle naturally as a woman is very, very difficult, and the results are nowhere near as prominent as it is with a man. And before some idiot chimes in by saying "ugh, more dudes who think women can't build muscle without steroids," note that I never said that women can't build muscle without steroids. They absolutely can, but the results are far less stark than those we are accustomed to seeing on sites like this.
I'm an athlete, and while I don't bodybuild I am around competitors and attend competitions and expos. I recently chatted with a former training partner who switched from CrossFit to bikini competitions and placed just short of winning a pro card at her last competition. Remember, bikini competitors are the smallest competitors at a bodybuilding show, and when we talked about the cycle her coach put her on, it was a LOT of compounds. If your average amateur bikini athlete is using that many compounds, you can only imagine what bigger and more defined competitors are using. Bikini competitors are not just "using a bit of anavar."
And when it comes to sides, while yes, taking more and harsher compounds can result in virilization, more often than not its genetics that cause those changes. Think of Dani Reardon. It's not hard to conclude that she was on a lot of compounds, but it's clear she was genetically blessed because she barely developed any virilization. Meanwhile, I know guys who ran a beginner test cycle and pretty much lost their entire hairline. OP, you can't move the goalpost by claiming that those signs are indicative of being "roided to the max." How well you respond to PEDs, and the negative side effects you get from them, are primarily determined by your genetics.
I never understood why some dudes are so adamant to defend a bodybuilder/athlete's claim that they are natural, as if the knowledge of them using PEDs ruins their fetish. Why does it? Steroids are not some magic bullet. You still have to put a ton of work in, and in fact even more work versus that of a natural athlete, and you still have to have your nutrition and recovery in check. I also know men and women who use but train and eat like shit, and it shows. Part of being into buff women is accepting that the physique that turns you on is more than likely not natural. And if you can't accept that, you better start getting into much, much smaller and less defined women.
For me I start losing interest when side effects start to become apparent.
There's probably a point where they're taking roids but I have no idea, as side effects aren't yet visible but they are getting a nicer physique as a result. Or, to use MSPaint:
Great use of Paint! 😂
I think that’s exactly where I’d be at. Some noticeable side effects would be fine but at some point there’s a bridge too far where I would draw the line….got me thinking where that line would be 🤔
There is no bodybuilding (male or female) without PEDs, so anyone who values the former also needs to accept the latter. For females in particular, restricting oneself to natural physiques only will lose you about 95% of the content on this site, and the "but she LOOKS natty" angle only works as long as you don't know what unenhanced physiques actually look like. For me, the bottom line is simple: As long as the girl finds no issue with PED usage, I don't have a reason to find any either.
Great thread. I love grip strength. Usually if a girl has big or strong looking hands I will challenge her to a game of mercy. Usually they are happy to play
It was a shame the tall sand-judo(?) girl picked the rugby guy, with her skills for that game type she definitely could have been competitive against a man a couple of weight classes below her, but then she picked the heaviest guy remaining?!
Yeah I was thinking the same. She picked the worst possible opponent for the event. I mean the purpose is who can hold the ball and you pick a heavy rugby guy? I don't think that was brave, just stupid. So I suppose she just wanted out.
I have had some cases where i shake hands with women (men too) .and they hurt my hand. i have really wimpy baby hands. even most women have bigger hands than me.
As far as i know roids don't make you magically grow muscular. and it just makes it so the workouts become more efficient. so fbbs that took a lot of roids .still worked very hard
personally i don't care. and if this is what it takes for women to become super strong .it's fine for me. but sadly too many steroids cause side effects that make her less attractive. but for me only the most extreme cases are unattractive.
i also think it's odd how some women became very strong .despite not having many side effects .while others who are not as strong have the typical side effects.
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I'd love to, but it will never happen. Not to humblebrag, but there are probably fewer than 10 women in my country stronger than me.
I couldn't have explained my POV any better than this, well done!
There is always going to be side effects to PEDs. I think it is a bit hypocritical to when someone finds muscular women attractive, but only if they don't show too many side effects. There is a reason why female bodybuilders don't want guys that are attracted to them(schmoes). It is just a fantasy for a lot of them. These women are training their butts off to achieve an incredible level of athleticism only to be subjected to someone's fantasy. As far as Gatsby28's friend, she should've probably searched for another coach since she shouldn't be in a whole cocktail of drugs. Women really don't need as much drugs to gain muscle except the high level competitors and even still that can vary from athlete to athlete. Personally, I don't mind if she is hairier or has a deeper voice as long as she is comfortable with the trade offs in performance. My two cents.
Rack12 wrote {{ I don't think I'd like to be with one especially if she looks bigger and stronger. I'd want that privately, but not in the open for everyone to see.}}
Tre's response {{ Wow.😕}}. I'm with Tre' on this. I loved being with such a strong, muscular woman. Yeah, I got some wise cracks and snickers but I was very proud of her. I bought her as many halter tops and sleeveless outfits, as my meager income could afford. I showed her off every chance I had.
I love it when most of a woman's body is just lean and tight and just slightly built up, but she has very strong, washboard abs!
Love the cartoon proportion of anything. Gigantic quads or balloon calves on otherwise 'normal' frame. Ultra wide lats.
Anything just plain big on what is otherwise in proportion.
Wow. 😕
Are there any kinds of disproportions you enjoy on a muscular girl?
I'm kinda fascinated by Ruzhena Bedzir's body, a lot of bicep meat in amazing shape, but not that much muscularity otherwise (maybe except for glutes). Same goes for most female armwrestlers, gigantic forearms that make their big biceps looks average in contrast.
This has been very informative, and thanks for the detail there Gatsby. At the end of the day, I think you're right. We shouldn't expect that these girls are all natural. I guess I'm just not at all in to the totally huge she-hulk look. As in, she's 5'5", weighs 220lbs and all muscle. Hard pass! Absent that, zits all of he face, and deep voice (other side effects) are also buzz kills.
So for me, as long as they still look and (even more importantly) SOUND female... I can be into that. I can at least pretend they're natural :D
Interesting topic. Doesnt matter for me as long as they dont become nearly transgender.
A lot of people here have mentioned the deep voice side effect.
The thing about that is... some of the smaller women you'd never think would have a deep voice, do... and some of the larger women you'd expect to have a deep voice, don't.
I know I've experienced this many times, but I don't recall many specific examples. In the latter category I think I remember Angie Salvagno and Michaela Aycock having unexpectedly feminine voices despite their size. I will say that with Michaela this is from 3-4 years ago so it's possible her voice has deepened since then.
The smaller women (Bikini-level and smaller) don't interest me as much and so the examples (of deeper than expected voices) I've seen aren't as memorable.
That MSPaint chart is terrific (grin). That's pretty much how I feel about it.
This isn't an easy call for me. I'd prefer all-natural gal, but if she's using a tiny touch of Anavar to get good results I wouldn't be terribly bothered. But, when she starts going bald and developing the deep voice it becomes a big no-go for me.
Of course (unless she's a genetic freak) she'll never get the huge, massive, bodybuilding-style muscularity without heavy PED use ... and that's okay with me.
That's why I usually watch the videos with the sound turned off. I've occasionally left it on and when they sound like Barry White or James Earl Jones it's a major buzz kill.
Agreed.
A lot of guys here (especially the ones who don't train themselves) really have no clue as to what is achievable naturally, especially as a woman. Having a preference for muscular women means accepting the fact that the overwhelming majority of physiques that we find visually appealing are not possible unless one is using PEDs. The problem (for lack of a better word) with sites like this is that it results in a kind of confirmation bias amongst the guys who browse it. They see a ubiquitous number of muscular women and think it's becoming more of a norm, or that it represents the results of women starting to get into the weight room. That warped view results in when they see an actual natural woman who lifts 5+ days a week, but think they either don't lift or barely do. Gaining muscle naturally as a woman is very, very difficult, and the results are nowhere near as prominent as it is with a man. And before some idiot chimes in by saying "ugh, more dudes who think women can't build muscle without steroids," note that I never said that women can't build muscle without steroids. They absolutely can, but the results are far less stark than those we are accustomed to seeing on sites like this.
I'm an athlete, and while I don't bodybuild I am around competitors and attend competitions and expos. I recently chatted with a former training partner who switched from CrossFit to bikini competitions and placed just short of winning a pro card at her last competition. Remember, bikini competitors are the smallest competitors at a bodybuilding show, and when we talked about the cycle her coach put her on, it was a LOT of compounds. If your average amateur bikini athlete is using that many compounds, you can only imagine what bigger and more defined competitors are using. Bikini competitors are not just "using a bit of anavar."
And when it comes to sides, while yes, taking more and harsher compounds can result in virilization, more often than not its genetics that cause those changes. Think of Dani Reardon. It's not hard to conclude that she was on a lot of compounds, but it's clear she was genetically blessed because she barely developed any virilization. Meanwhile, I know guys who ran a beginner test cycle and pretty much lost their entire hairline. OP, you can't move the goalpost by claiming that those signs are indicative of being "roided to the max." How well you respond to PEDs, and the negative side effects you get from them, are primarily determined by your genetics.
I never understood why some dudes are so adamant to defend a bodybuilder/athlete's claim that they are natural, as if the knowledge of them using PEDs ruins their fetish. Why does it? Steroids are not some magic bullet. You still have to put a ton of work in, and in fact even more work versus that of a natural athlete, and you still have to have your nutrition and recovery in check. I also know men and women who use but train and eat like shit, and it shows. Part of being into buff women is accepting that the physique that turns you on is more than likely not natural. And if you can't accept that, you better start getting into much, much smaller and less defined women.
Great use of Paint! 😂
I think that’s exactly where I’d be at. Some noticeable side effects would be fine but at some point there’s a bridge too far where I would draw the line….got me thinking where that line would be 🤔
I'm not only fine with steroids but most of the side effects don't bother me at all, quite the contrary.
There is no bodybuilding (male or female) without PEDs, so anyone who values the former also needs to accept the latter. For females in particular, restricting oneself to natural physiques only will lose you about 95% of the content on this site, and the "but she LOOKS natty" angle only works as long as you don't know what unenhanced physiques actually look like. For me, the bottom line is simple: As long as the girl finds no issue with PED usage, I don't have a reason to find any either.
Andrea Shaw
Great thread. I love grip strength. Usually if a girl has big or strong looking hands I will challenge her to a game of mercy. Usually they are happy to play
Anne
Yeah I was thinking the same. She picked the worst possible opponent for the event. I mean the purpose is who can hold the ball and you pick a heavy rugby guy? I don't think that was brave, just stupid. So I suppose she just wanted out.
Too bad, she was gorgeous.
So, by all means tell us your experiences! :)
I have had some cases where i shake hands with women (men too) .and they hurt my hand. i have really wimpy baby hands. even most women have bigger hands than me.
As far as i know roids don't make you magically grow muscular. and it just makes it so the workouts become more efficient. so fbbs that took a lot of roids .still worked very hard
personally i don't care. and if this is what it takes for women to become super strong .it's fine for me. but sadly too many steroids cause side effects that make her less attractive. but for me only the most extreme cases are unattractive.
i also think it's odd how some women became very strong .despite not having many side effects .while others who are not as strong have the typical side effects.
The voice change is brutal