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This is all a very interesting study in (1) How many times can I split an hair, and (2) How many Angels can dance upon the sharp point of a common pin.
Personally, I would prefer to go with the concept of Tolerance. If someone believes that they are Female but born Male, that is fine with me. Of course, there will be obvious drawbacks to such an assertion since the individual will not have to deal with childbirth, menstrual pain and the miriad other issues that strike women exclusively. And such issues --- in the modern Internet World --- do not matter. So, it is, to me anyways, better to Tolerate such Belief Systems and allow them their very peculiar journey in Life.
I'm all for tolerance. It's acceptance - weaponized acceptance - that has been a problem, esp. when women's competitions started legitimizing biological men's participation. So I say stick with the trans females tolerated on the forum. Non-binary is virtual make-believe IMO, so if "they/them" is a biological female, then she can be tolerated on the main gallery if she wants in.
LOL...breasts are amazing and, very few digital art are any good (so far). But the point here is not about such things at all. And in responding to Bat I would say that Tolerance takes in Acceptance as a subset. Of course, there are those that will try to force Acceptance but that is merely a knee-jerk reaction to almost-violent (which is often seen in murders of trans-sexuals all over this Planet) or always-violent reactionaries. One cannot blame the murdered for the violence. Small minds do violence.
So, in effect, this is a very serious subject and is not funny at all.
For the record.. I'm not arguing for trans or non-binary models to be featured on this site.
I was doing that for a while. The mission statement framed this site as a repository of user-submitted images. Regardless of what some users may think, there are muscular trans and NB people who are objectively hot, but the mods made the decision to exclude them, and that's ultimately their choice. It's a private business. Other sites like HerBiceps are exclusionary too.
So, you don't have to fight me to the death on this point. I do find the idea of "straight" and "gay" to be pretty interesting when it comes to trans people though. I'm bisexual, so I don't live in this box.. but it's personally fascinating to investigate it.
I contend that basic hetero and homo sexuality is centered around a mix of gender cues. When trans people enter the picture, these gender cues can supercede the person's sex at birth. And their genitalia.
For example, here is a male-to-female trans person named Dion. Pretty sure they have a penis.
And here's a female-to-male trans person named Pasha. Pretty sure they have a vagina...
Now, for the guys who are absolute about biology and feel that sexuality is totally fixed.. would you say that it's straight for man to like Pasha, but gay for a man to like Pasha?
For the record.. I'm not arguing for trans or non-binary models to be featured on this site.
I was doing that for a while. The mission statement framed this site as a repository of user-submitted images. Regardless of what some users may think, there are muscular trans and NB people who are objectively hot, but the mods made the decision to exclude them, and that's ultimately their choice. It's a private business. Other sites like HerBiceps are exclusionary too.
So, you don't have to fight me to the death on this point. I do find the idea of "straight" and "gay" to be pretty interesting when it comes to trans people though. I'm bisexual, so I don't live in this box.. but it's personally fascinating to investigate it.
I contend that basic hetero and homo sexuality is centered around a mix of gender cues. When trans people enter the picture, these gender cues can supercede the person's sex at birth. And their genitalia.
For example, here is a male-to-female trans person named Dion. Pretty sure they have a penis.
And here's a female-to-male trans person named Pasha. Pretty sure they have a vagina...
Now, for the guys who are absolute about biology and feel that sexuality is totally fixed.. would you say that it's straight for man to like Pasha, but gay for a man to like Pasha?
Tell me you're arguing for trans or non-binary models to be featured on this site without telling me you're arguing for trans or non-binary models to be featured on this site.
Just create your own topic dedicated to trans worship / catfishing, Mr. Bisexual (which I must admit to wondering if there's a T accompanying that B after all the times you've gone down this particular rabbit hole).
Tell me you're arguing for trans or non-binary models to be featured on this site without telling me you're arguing for trans or non-binary models to be featured on this site.
Just create your own topic dedicated to trans worship / catfishing, Mr. Bisexual (which I must admit to wondering if there's a T accompanying that B after all the times you've gone down this particular rabbit hole).
Bro. I'd just be interested in you answering the question.
You'll note that I never start these threads. And I've accepted that this site is going to exclude pretty much anyone who makes a vocal minority uncomfortable.
I don't go down this rabbit hole because I'm secretly trans. It's because I find homophobia and transphobia in bodybuilding to be absolutely ridiculous.
Male bodybuilding is an express admiration for the almost completely nude male form. It isn't homosexual per se, but male bodybuilding competitors and fans should understand where gay guys are coming from. Their interests are quite adjacent.
Ditto for female bodybuilding. Like it or not, the hormone profiles and developing secondary sex characteristics of many muscular women are aligned with biological males, and the VAST majority of humans would look at the vast majority of women on this site and think that they're trans. That's real.
Now I'm not saying that FBB's are trans or that FBB fans have to be attracted to trans women, but I'm frustrated when guys are explicitly bigoted against trans women but also fans of female bodybuilding. I think it's ridiculous. The worlds are closer than you think.
And in regards to this site: it's a thirst trap for horny guys (including me), and I accept that certain horny guys have their reasons for not wanting to view trans models. I don't sympathize with those reasons, but I accept them. So there isn't an argument any more from me on that point.
The sites called "girls" with muscles not men who wanna be girls with muscle if that's what you are looking for I advice you to watch gay porn instead of floating around here making meaningless noise
Apart from the absolutely atrocious grammar, Kaangzn is a prime example of the gang that just don't get it.
"homophobia and transphobia". Always these political buzzwords to declare someone a irrational nutcase for having a different opinion. I'm kinda bi (only in my fantasy, not in real life) and I like some of the trans stuff but this wording and the intention behind it is absolutely annoying. especially when you think about the tons of real idiots and even criminals who are part of the trans movement. people have no idea what disgusting individuals these people are. Thanks God that Musk throw a lot of them out of Twitter.
the sooner people in favor of including non-binary / transwomen in the site realize they are not arguing against people in the same intellectual capacity, the faster they'll see it's pointless to even try. It's clear as day which side is presenting reasonable arguments and which side's resorting to "a wamen iz xx only, ur just ghey".
A simple filter that enables/disables said content is a simple solution but god forbid people spend 2 seconds reading and clicking (well maybe 4 since they're only using 1 hand).
"homophobia and transphobia". Always these political buzzwords to declare someone a irrational nutcase for having a different opinion. I'm kinda bi (only in my fantasy, not in real life) and I like some of the trans stuff but this wording and the intention behind it is absolutely annoying. especially when you think about the tons of real idiots and even criminals who are part of the trans movement. people have no idea what disgusting individuals these people are. Thanks God that Musk throw a lot of them out of Twitter.
It's amazing that you mention "real idiots" and "criminals" on Twitter and then connect that to trans people.
Like, have you seen Twitter recently? It has the absolute worst bigotry and hate speech that you can find on a smartphone. It's why they lost so much of their advertisers. The site is a total failure, and that guy pissed away countless billions of Saudi investment money on it.
I mean, there may have some terrible trans people too but they'd have to be the freaking Keyser Soze of LGBT to compete on that level. Things are insane on there.
XY = male that is it. Trans have their own category and need to stay there, but they are not girls with muscle. girls not trans, not xy with fem genitals.
Bro. I'd just be interested in you answering the question.
The question doesn't apply to me since you put it out there for the guys who are absolute about biology and feel that sexuality is totally fixed.
You'll note that I never start these threads. And I've accepted that this site is going to exclude pretty much anyone who makes a vocal minority uncomfortable.
Maybe a vocal minority, but representative of GWM's silent majority. As for being excluded, there's a whole Trans Women board for visitors into that kind of thing.
I don't go down this rabbit hole because I'm secretly trans. It's because I find homophobia and transphobia in bodybuilding to be absolutely ridiculous.
I'm not a fan of misogyny in sports when kowtowing to trans ideologues, myself.
Male bodybuilding is an express admiration for the almost completely nude male form. It isn't homosexual per se, but male bodybuilding competitors and fans should understand where gay guys are coming from. Their interests are quite adjacent.
I don't see anything disagreeable there.
Ditto for female bodybuilding. Like it or not, the hormone profiles and developing secondary sex characteristics of many muscular women are aligned with biological males, and the VAST majority of humans would look at the vast majority of women on this site and think that they're trans. That's real.
Far more realistic is the average Joe and Jane being repulsed by many of the musclebound women here, using slurs like "dudes", "steroid pigs", and "she-males". These insults are used precisely because the offenders recognize their targets, however unappealing, as being in fact women.
Now I'm not saying that FBB's are trans or that FBB fans have to be attracted to trans women, but I'm frustrated when guys are explicitly bigoted against trans women but also fans of female bodybuilding. I think it's ridiculous. The worlds are closer than you think.
The worlds are as close as the biologies and gender stereotypes of women and men allow them to be; this regardless of how a particular group of men identify themselves, about which the other men and women are not obligated to agree.
And it isn't ridiculous for FBB fans to put more stock in women than men. It's why they're FBB fans in the first place. Even if I feel they go too far with the virilization, there's something more meaningful in a female's muscle massing feats and gains that isn't shared by a fellow gear head with a biological male template.
And in regards to this site: it's a thirst trap for horny guys (including me), and I accept that certain horny guys have their reasons for not wanting to view trans models. I don't sympathize with those reasons, but I accept them. So there isn't an argument any more from me on that point.
the sooner people in favor of including non-binary / transwomen in the site are not arguing against people in the same intellectual capacity, the faster you'll see it's pointless to try. It's clear as day which side is presenting reasonable arguments and which side's resorting to "a wamen iz xx only, ur just ghey".
A simple filter that enables/disables said content is a simple solution but god forbid people spend 2 seconds reading and clicking (well maybe 4 since they're only using 1 hand).
a woman is XX only, though
I guess what I'm hoping for is understanding. I see far too much denigration and reflexive anger whenever these threads come up.
Just to make it clear: it's okay to be discriminating in your sexual attraction.
I'll tell you guys right now: I find fat people to be absolutely repulsive from an attraction standpoint. Even kind of fat. Like off-season Ranya Dally is more than I can deal with. I won't entertain the idea of being touched by someone with a few extra pounds. It's a complete boner killer for me. And that's okay. I'm allowed to limit my attraction to people who are fit and lean.
Of course there are fat people in my family and my place of work and I treat them with the respect that I would anyone else. I don't assume that they're lazy or bad or weak. I don't talk badly about them or reject the basic humanity. I'm just sexually turned off by them. Hence I'm always on this site or looking at male bodybuilders.
I'd like to see that kind of understanding for LGBT folks here. I'd push back on a thread bashing fat women just as much as a thread bashing trans women.
B2 english only get you this far but thanks bro
I did not mean to offend you Kaan. I know that you are likely on a smartphone (which is just a word to cover for the failures of the Tech Industry), so, what with ignorant AI trying to correct your thought as you express it and the terrible response of all touchscreens, the usual result is gibberish, or, very near to that.
Still, you might spend some time reading (reading from books rather than digital sources since digital sources are almost always un-edited or generated by AI bots) from actual books. There, you will discover grammar at it's very best.
I guess what I'm hoping for is understanding. I see far too much denigration and reflexive anger whenever these threads come up.
Just to make it clear: it's okay to be discriminating in your sexual attraction.
I'll tell you guys right now: I find fat people to be absolutely repulsive from an attraction standpoint. Even kind of fat. Like off-season Ranya Dally is more than I can deal with. I won't entertain the idea of being touched by someone with a few extra pounds. It's a complete boner killer for me. And that's okay. I'm allowed to limit my attraction to people who are fit and lean.
Of course there are fat people in my family and my place of work and I treat them with the respect that I would anyone else. I don't assume that they're lazy or bad or weak. I don't talk badly about them or reject the basic humanity. I'm just sexually turned off by them. Hence I'm always on this site or looking at male bodybuilders.
I'd like to see that kind of understanding for LGBT folks here. I'd push back on a thread bashing fat women just as much as a thread bashing trans women.
Seems to me Muscles_Toez, that you are speaking from a position of Tolerance and Acceptance (which is a subset of Tolerance). As far as I am concerned, you win the Grand Prize of Gourmet Pizza's for Life and a place on the UN Council on Human Rights.
I guess what I'm hoping for is understanding. I see far too much denigration and reflexive anger whenever these threads come up.
Just to make it clear: it's okay to be discriminating in your sexual attraction.
I'll tell you guys right now: I find fat people to be absolutely repulsive from an attraction standpoint. Even kind of fat. Like off-season Ranya Dally is more than I can deal with. I won't entertain the idea of being touched by someone with a few extra pounds. It's a complete boner killer for me. And that's okay. I'm allowed to limit my attraction to people who are fit and lean.
Of course there are fat people in my family and my place of work and I treat them with the respect that I would anyone else. I don't assume that they're lazy or bad or weak. I don't talk badly about them or reject the basic humanity. I'm just sexually turned off by them. Hence I'm always on this site or looking at male bodybuilders.
I'd like to see that kind of understanding for LGBT folks here. I'd push back on a thread bashing fat women just as much as a thread bashing trans women.
I don't want it to look like I'm haranguing you in particular, so I'll leave off with this:
I'm no fan of morbid obesity. I've seen enough of it and its comorbidities' effects on people. I'm not going out of my way to bash such obese people, but if a few of them are going to push that "fat acceptance/body positivity" out there to the masses, then I'm going to share my disbelief on that particular subject as well. That was my change of attitude about trans ideology, when it went from people living with gender dysphoria to ideologues pushing their beliefs' dubious legitimacy out into the world. So I'll speak my peace re: women's sports, children's upbringing, and GWM's galleries. Proponents can invoke the greater alphabet community all they want, but I draw a line between the sexual orientation letters and all the "I walk in my truth" add-ons.
I did not mean to offend you Kaan. I know that you are likely on a smartphone (which is just a word to cover for the failures of the Tech Industry), so, what with ignorant AI trying to correct your thought as you express it and the terrible response of all touchscreens, the usual result is gibberish, or, very near to that.
Still, you might spend some time reading (reading from books rather than digital sources since digital sources are almost always un-edited or generated by AI bots) from actual books. There, you will discover grammar at it's very best.
No offense taken bro mistakes can be made and I will be trying to improve myself for it. So thanks for the advice.
I think I’ve read more than enough input from people at this point to make the determination that some of you are just scared you might whack off to someone trans by accident and then you’ll have to be gay for the rest of your lives.
If anyone has had their mind changed one way or the other by this whole conversation, I’d love to hear which argument convinced you.
if they're born female then they're a female. if someone wants to upload her pics to this site since it's dedicated to girls with muscle then they should be allowed to, given that they're women with muscles. just because she butchered her body and made it substantially less feminine doesn't mean much. next to nobody would be interested in posting or favoriting images of people like this though